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Discussion: Grados artificiales en España

  • Started: 10 weeks ago on Tue 22nd Dec 2020

Public discussion This is a public discussion in Spain.

started this discussion 10 weeks ago.

Grados artificiales en España

Hola,

Quién podría explicar los siguentes grados:

  • V+ / Ae
  • 6b+ / Ae

Es lo mismo que V+ A0 y 6b+ A0? Cómo entrarías esos grados en theCrag? Parece que "Ae" no es valido.

Gracias

replied 10 weeks ago.

Hard to say if those are free climbs or aid climbs from the "topo". But at the moment, it's not possible to add (edit: several grades like 7a, 6a A0) to routes on theCrag except putting it in the description.

replied 10 weeks ago.

It's not answering Dominik question but of course you can record an aid grade on theCrag . I'm afraid to say I have never seen the notation "Ae"...

replied 10 weeks ago.

Assuming this is an aid climb (or maybe a sport climb with a small aid section), would you then set the route type as Sport or as Aid?

replied 10 weeks ago.

Okay, I searched around the web and found this description:

"Ae. Artificial equipado. El largo está equipado con clavos, spits, parabolts o material abandonado (fisureros, plomos, etc.)"

Source

Seems that the route is supposedly equipped with means of artificial climbing. Probably means old rusty stuff and you better protect it yourself.

Alfonso replied 10 weeks ago.

Hi Dominik assuming that the rest didn't care to much about what Ae mean here in Spain (and out of Spain I guess should be the same) and that for what I see in the first message you understand Spanish I will splain it to you in Psanish, but if the eis any one interested on it I can translate it later 🙃.

A0, A1 y el resto de la terminología es cuando los seguros son todos flotantes (fisureros, friends, etc.) Ae sería cuando laceras una cinta o cuando en una vía equipada usas una pedalea o técnicas de artificial para sacar un paso que no seas capaz de realizar en libre.

En el caso de la foto, normalmente debería de aparecer algo así como 7a, 6b+/Ae. Que vendría a significar que la vía es un 7a pero que si el paso clave agarras la cinta, haces una pedaleta con dos cintas, etc. pues pasaría a ser la vía un 6b+. Como en la foto que has pasado solo indica 6b+/Ae podría significar dos cosas, una que quien haya puesto ese grado lo ha hecho agarrando cinta o lo que sea y no sabe que grado saldría en libre, o que la vía es un 6b+ pero que los parabolts están lo suficientemente cerca unos de otros para lacerar la vía entera.

Un saludo y espero haberte resuelto la duda, si no es así ya me dirás 🙃🙃.

replied 10 weeks ago.

Ulfi What I wanted to say was, that it's not possible to assign a "7a, 6b A0" grade yet. If the described routes are pure aid routes, my comment was indeed not relevant.

Like Alfonso said, it's not clear from the topo if it's aid or free with optional aid. I'd interpret the "/" as an "or". So maybe "6b+ but crux can be aided".

replied 9 weeks ago.

Gracias a todos.

It seems Ae cannot be modeled 100% correctly in thecrag, yet.

replied 9 weeks ago.

Dominik can you add a GitHub Issue on that and explain where this comes from and how it translates please? Happy New Year!!

replied 9 weeks ago.

I found an interesting definition on https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graduaci%C3%B3n_de_dificultad#Escalada_Artificial

In essence they say, if a route has no equipped gear (bolts, pitons, etc.) it goes from A0, A1, ... However, when there is already equipment (or gear) in the wall, then you add an "e" to the grade, e.g. A0e, A1e, ...

However, the Ae grade is not explained well in that context. I've only found sources talking about "Ae" only, or about A0e, A1e, ... but without mentioning "Ae"

Alfonso Do you think Ae is the same and maybe just an abbreviation for A0e?

Ulfi the whole "Ae" thing is not 100% clear to me yet. I'm afraid I cannot explain this well enough in an issue yet - without having to make assumptions at least.

replied 9 weeks ago.

OK, great - it's a start - please keep us posted if this is something we need to add...

replied 9 weeks ago.

Looks like you need to climb some of those routes. You can tell us afterwards what it means.

replied 9 weeks ago.

Tobias Auth I wish. Two small kids at home right now - one a fresh baby. Confined to "online climbing" for the time being... =)

Alfonso replied 9 weeks ago.

Dominik what I explained earlier was more from my experience climbing here in Spain rather that form my understanding of aid climbing. And the thing is that I have only see the "Ae" terminology in multipitch sport climbing (some times I have found it in sport climbing routes too but rather than in a guide in a random internet blog).

Then for what I know, Aoe or A1e isn't really used... But I am not that much into aid climbing, so maybe I am wrong about it not been used.

Anyway, in the link that you have send what is explained there is that while in A0, A1, A2, etc the number go according with the exposure of the pitch and the difficulty in placing the Cams, pistons, etc.

And for A0e, A1e, etc. This nomenclature with the "e" is used only if the pitch is fully equipped using A0e when you just grab the Quickdraw to progress and A1e, A2e and A3e if you use stirrups for climbing, differencianting the 1, 2 or 3 if it is a wall, an overhanging or a roof.

And actually they said that sometimes in the case of A0e they put A0 for simplicity and here goes my guess, I would say that rather that A0 for simplicity what the put is Ae.

So answering your question I would said that yes, Ae is the same that A0e. 🙃🙃

replied 9 weeks ago.

Danke!

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