Discussion: Environmentally and Culturally sensitive site

Access Environmentally and Culturally sensitive site

The Big Pump is a significant enclosed shelter identified as a highly cultural, scientific and archaeological site. The Aboriginal Heritage Information Management System (AHIMS) identifies the site as “De Burghs Bridge”. Previous and ongoing site planning assessments identified the presence of artefacts (shells & flakes) which have since been removed and/or disturbed. National Parks has concerns with climbers chalk and erosion at this area. Do not light fires, remove soil from base of problems or camp in the cave.

This is dead set bullshit. I have embraced and enjoyed and been fullfilled bouldering in this cave. I haven't lit fires, left bongs syringes or blow up mattresses and condoms as other pestilence have.who has encouraged NPWS to this action and who is shoving this bullshit down our throat?

Considering that the Big Pump does not appear on the AHIMS database I think LCRNP have got it wrong. Eamonn do you have any details or link that you can point us to where national parks have flagged this as a culturally sensitive site so that ACANSW can investigate before you start chopping bolts?

I've just been informed by a colleague who works for national parks that this is the case. A number of community groups have apparently been unhappy with climbing there for a while. I am but a messenger, not the bolt chopper.

OK Thanks Eamonn

Is the issue with the bolts or with climbing in general?

Both

is there any official updates to confirm the flagging of this site. Would like to make sure.

I'd also like confirmation as to whether climbing is restricted just to the main cave, or the lower cave also.

Please post an official link so that all may be informed and referenced. People are still climbing here since I checked a couple of days ago, and I'd like not to make unfounded directives.

Many thanks

After emailing Lane Cove national parks, can confirm that this is a site of cultural significance. Here is the email I received

"The site identified as The Big Pump is a significant enclosed shelter identified as a highly cultural, scientific and archaeological site. The Aboriginal Heritage Information Management System (AHIMS) identifies the site as “De Burghs Bridge”. Previous and ongoing site planning assessments identified the presence of artefacts (shells & flakes) which have since been removed and/or disturbed. Over the years, the continued use of the site for rock climbing has resulted in excessive chalking (and impregnation into the sandstone itself) and heightened erosion due to climbing. Overuse of the site with chalk has evidently ‘de-faced’ the natural and cultural aspect of the site.

Consultation between the National Parks and Wildlife Service and Metropolitan Local Aboriginal Land Council will continue to take place to formulate and initiate a response to the sites’ disturbances. This may result in liaison with members of the climbing community such as yourself to better educate climbers of the areas they may be unknowingly impacting."

So as Earmonn stated climbing should cease here for access elsewhere. I also got an image of an extensive AHIMS search but cannot attach it.

Thanks for the update Saxon. If there’s no objections, I think it’s probably best to change this area to ‘Closed’ status on the crag.

Probably for the best

Saxon - with your extensive search do you have an aboriginal heritage number we can reference? I'll get ACANSW to update the site status.

45-6-2213 is the site ID for the De Burghs Bridge extensive search.

Thank you for the info! Good to have a conclusive status for this crag.

Much appreciation for the effort

David Filan I feel you dude, I’m actually hella pissed off too. Seems like lots of sydney classics are being closed off one by one, even though artefacts have since then been removed/ displaced, so the justification of the ban isn’t based on new archeological reasonings. Why are they only banning it now? 3 decades or so later, there is an established climbing culture in the area, which holds a big significance to those climbers. Why isn’t that considered? What’s next? Crumbly and sissy are right next to the lake so I’m sure there’s something there too. There has to be a way where we can respect Aboriginal culture, but still share this space as it holds importance to two different groups of people.

Hi All, to be be clear there is no conclusive status for this crag. There is no formal announcement or documentation posted by Lane Cove River National Park. The next step is to arrange for a formal meeting between LCRNP and ACANSW to determine the path forward - in Europe for example climbing and bouldering take place and are sanctioned in similarly culturally sensitive areas (i.e. registered Neanderthal sites and other sites with deep cultural history) - so it would be nice if we could do the same. Saxon, Timothy, Eamonn & Eson are you currently members of ACANSW as we are looking for people to help with access issues and to try to work out a way that all groups can share and enjoy our natural spaces? Guys - PM me if you're interested in helping out with ACANSW and The Big Pump to start with.

I have removed the closed status as it is not completely conclusive. I still think until it is resolved people probably shouldn't climb in my opinion just in case.

I started to climb there about 8 months ago. At that time, it was trashed with broken bottles and other rubbish. I took out about 5 loads of trash and cleaned it up. I'd argue that the climbing community helps upkeep these important sites. Without any activity, the site will go back to a party site for misguided youth. Is there anyone at NP to contact regarding this site?

ACANSW has sent a detailed letter to LCNP. We are awaiting a response.

Okay, great. Thanks.

Good stuff Ryan Armstrong !!

Hi all, does anyone know if ACANSW ever heard back from LCNP?

Nope. Never got a response.